Wednesday, June 11, 2008

Trade Winds

[dd.png]

Well, Pierre McGuire got on XM Radio Tuesday morning and decided to throw this "Malkin to the Kings" thing into the limelight.


Remember, he was the one who said during the '06-'07 season that HCMT was gone for sure.

The prevailing thought is that Malkin doesn't want to play second fiddle to Crosby for his whole career.

But then again, money talks.
If someone paid you big bucks to do something you love,
you'd play a fiddle naked at halftime of the Super Bowl while eating balls.

But this rumor first came about back in February.
Someone "in the know" circulated the rumor.
This was amidst Malkin's insanity in Crosby's absence.

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The rumors don't end there.
Apparently, the Blue Jackets want the rights to Orpik or Malone. [ Puck-Rakers ]
[ Zach L. ] sent that in.

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Just because the season is over doesn't mean jackassery stops running rampant.

:: This is why some people shouldn't have internet access.
Some joke tell us not to get carried with this MAF Phenom stuff. [ Stan Fischler at Game On ]



Remember all the talk about experience being the difference in the Finals?

According to Stan the Man, it seems that when an up-and-coming goalie gives up some softies in the Finals,
it all of a sudden means he's not as good as advertised.

No, he's just not experienced. He's 23 years old.
We're not consistent with paying our bills on time.
So don't expect a 23-year-old to be consistent in his first Stanley Cup Final.

[ Puck Daddy ] laid into Fischler for the article.


[ Pat S. ]
:: The officiating in the SCF was biased towards the Pens. [ National Post ]


:: The Boss puts the Pens 4th in his season-ending power rankings. [ Yahoo ]


:: A woman who no one cares about (and who will die alone) hates the city of Pittsburgh.
[ Puck Daddy ]

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:: We respect Christy for her work over at [ Behind The Jersey ]


It looks like Niklas Kronwall loves the blog, too...maybe a little bit too much.


But she drove Red Corvette in the Cup Parade.
Speaking of which, did Lee P. die? [ Lee P. ]

:: Some asshat in Pittsburgh raped someone. [ WPXI ]
He should have been shot on sight.

Instead when police came to his house to can him,
he decided to engage in a standoff.

It's no surprise that he was sporting a Red Wings Cup Champions shirt.


Thanks to [ FritoWill ]

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Game #4
[ Don't Call It A Comeback. PENS WIN. ]




A comeback win for the Pens early in the season.
Never a bad thing.

C-BLOG CITY

[ff.png]

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Go Pens

We'll be tackling all this free-agency business in the near future.

237 comments:

debrisslide said...

GOOD MORNING PENSBLOG

First maybe?

I hate the media in general. They're like a bunch of starved dogs congregating around a rotten carcass. In the case of pro sports this carcass is the offseason. BOO.

J.S. said...

ugh, no firstblog

secondblog

debrisslide said...

It's okay j.s. At least you're awake. That's as good as being first.

jefe penguino said...

i say we trade MAKLIN, and keep gino.

time for nyquilblog. night.

go pens.

sh0ez said...

I'm usually fifth-tenthblog. I always catch it a bit late. Is it just me, or has the late night cblog crowd gone gone away for the most part?

J.S. said...

being up at 235 = not good, especially when I have (or had) to be up at 530.

xuscbausp said...

why am i up so early?
better question: why is the first thing i check still pensblog?

cause you guys rock.

gnitepartIIblog

Beav said...

I guess everyone around here is getting into offseason mode (more like slackers getting a job after the Pens season ends mode)

runningonnosleepblog

Stilly said...

Gary do I hate Pierre McGuire. What an ass clown.

Johnny P. said...

Whats up C-Blog? Wow, the Pens and our town in general are getting blasted by the media. Judging by what I have read our entire team except for Crosby is leaving this summer because this is a horrible place to play. Everything will work out though because we get every call imaginable. ARE THEY SERIOUS? Detroit had something like ten more power plays in the final series than we did. I thought the officiating was consistent, poor, but consistent. I first heard the power rankings on Around the Rinks on XM 204 two days ago and could not believe that the Pens were 4th. Pointless, but no respect. How do you loose in the finals and get jumped by a conference final looser and a bunch of underacheiving experts' "favorites" whom got peaced out in the second round. HORRIBLE. And that chick who hates Pittsburgh has chipmunk cheeks.
...end RantBlog.

demondg1 said...

I'm still drunk from last night.

Sooska said...

More on Tiger Woods. Even before tPB and the Pens made NPR in the last few weeks I listened because there is no decent radio where I am except NPR.

I listened to NPR this morning and there was a news blurb about Tiger Woods and his "dissing" of hockey. He has issued a clarification "I love hockey but I dont like to watch it on TV" The NPR news reader says "That is what nongolfers say about golf."

Howevah, the golf foks have decided we hockey fans are "puck loving dunces." read on

Golfers Hate Hockey

demondg1 said...

F golf.

Stilly said...

Thanks for the link Sooska

"I’ll say it again. To enjoy hockey, you have to be dumber than a box of rocks or been raised dumb in this aspect (i.e. the unfortunate cursed Canadians among us)."

I can't belive this asshat. Here is a guy who blogs about GOLF for a living, saying you have to be dumb to enjoy hockey. Golf is the LEAST enjoyable sport to watch on the planet. I'd rather watch a 72 hour broadcast of Sunset Earth than 18 holes of golf.

Stilly said...

Sunrise earth.

That Dockers commercial has warped my mind.

J.S. said...

He has issued a clarification "I love hockey but I dont like to watch it on TV"

Whatev. The sound you just heard was Eldrick backpedaling on his gimpy knee.

I guess either him or his agent saw that people are still talking about this a week or so later and figured it was time for some damage control.

Dan said...

actually the article about fleury points out his weaknesses pretty well. it's why he should not get a huge contract yet, he needs to show that consistency over a year or two. i agree with the article, except the part about him costing us the cup. that was bullshit. i will not be around to discuss today :(

Colin said...

Whether you loved or hated MM, does anyone really like Ken Laird? God, he was campaining for the Pens to trade Malkin yesterday and I wanted an 18 wheeler to t-bone me. You DO NOT trade Malkin unless he makes some OUTLANDISH demands. It can be so frusterating at times.

I know that dude in the Red Wings shirt from the stand off in Greentree. He may have loved the Red Wings and some crazy stuff might have gone down the other day, but he is a good dude.

The Big K said...

Malkin is not getting traded.
Pierre needs to get laid, bad.

Stoosh said...

@ Colin -

I didn't hate Laird until yesterday. I've admittedly never listened to him carry a whole show before, but I've heard a lot of people complain about the fact that he seems to be contrarian just for the sake of being contrarian. Yesterday, I caught most of the first three hours of the show and I saw exactly what people were talking about. I can't stand Chris Mack and I was hoping maybe at some point, he'd reach across the studio and smack Laird across his head.

There were plenty of reasonable arguments presented as to why Malkin should NEVER be traded, yet Laird categorically refused to acknowledge any of them. He failed to listen to any alternatives (trade Whitney or maybe hold off on extending Staal until next summer, etc.). All he kept doing was boiling it down to either Malkin vs. Hossa or Malkin vs. Staal.

That's pointless in and of itself because that's not the way management is going to approach this. You've got to take the entire roster into consideration and look at how not just next year but subsequent years are going to be affected. In addition, Shero's not pitting one pending free agent against another and basing the decision solely on that. He's got to be taking this as a group of free agents, prioritizing them accordingly, and then trying to keep as many of the group as he can.

Colin said...

@ stoosh -

Ah, I totally agree. I don't really like Chris Mack either, but yesterday he was bearable. It gave some sensical agruements while it became pretty evident that Ken Laird was just trying to, in your appropriate words "play contrarian."

Laird was also saying how he thinks Staal won't be happy being just a third line center and will move on to another team. I am not sure I buy that if Staal is third line center (best one in hockey), number one penalty killer, and in front of the net on the power play. If he is playing all those important minutes on special teams, it makes sense that his normal ice time is going to be somewhat limited.

Lastly, say you do trade for Kopitar and Brown. Kopitar is restricted after next year so you are in the same boat. Kopitar, should he have a good year would command at least 6M a year. And you know what, I think that if you are spending 6M on Kopitar, who has not shown he can lead a team the way Malkin did last year, you spend and extra three and keep Malkin.

Finally, the thing that pissed me off the most was the fact that so many people were calling in and saying to keep Hossa instead of Malkin. Hossa is going to be 30. Malking is going to be 22. * years difference. Not to mention Hossa has or is very close to reaching his peak both point wise and physically. Whereas the sky is the limit for Malking. Not to mention that, personally, I think you build a team down the middle with centers, defense and goaltending.

Ugh.

Frusterationblog.

Max Power said...

Realityblog:

Golf = not a sport

Golf = hobby

Tiger = an animal

Tiger Woods = Nonalthetic piece of buffalo dung

People who hate Pittsburgh = People who have nothing better to do and whose parents never loved them

People doing some jobbin on the PENS = Canadian and New York media

Canadian media = Maple sucking moose fuckers

New York Media = nothing need to be said because that's worse than having the HIV

Pudgy Chick from Texas Media = Hell yeah she can eat a 1lbs hamburger. She's not fooling anyone with her modesty.

Donuts = still crazy delicious

Christina said...

max power, telling it like it is.

slush said...

Donuts = still crazy delicious

wise words my friend, wise words

Victor Raison said...

How can you hate Pittsburgh? That's pretty much the same as saying you hate bridges. And who honestly can say they hate bridges? They carry you over bodies of water and ravines.

Illogical.

Yinz Luv Da Guins said...

Hey Everyone,

Our last episode of the season is up and running:

Season Finale!

Thanks for watching throughout the playoffs!

The Seeker said...

Golf is the stupidest game ever invented!

You hit a little ball and then you go hunt for it. The first guy to find his ball should be the winner!

Golf also wastes more real estate than any game ever conceived....

Why is it that out of all the games that involve a ball, golf involves the smallest ball - yet at the same time demands the largest playing field?

Lee P said...

you = fuck lickers

me = tpb staff

Stoosh said...

@ Colin -

I am not sure I buy that if Staal is third line center (best one in hockey), number one penalty killer, and in front of the net on the power play. If he is playing all those important minutes on special teams, it makes sense that his normal ice time is going to be somewhat limited.

This is why I already miss Madden on the air; Madden would've pointed this out. Or at least Starkey would've as well.

With the chance that both Malone and Roberts are out of the picture for 2008-09, Staal becomes the logical choice to be the player that gets his ass kicked in front of the net on the power play. And there are few players on this team better at shoveling garbage than Staal.

The LA rumor bothers me, too, because no one is pointing out that it's a bad trade for LA to make. They've been promoting Kopitar, Brown, Frolov, Cammalleri and Jack Johnson as their core to their fanbase. I can't see them dealing two or maybe three of those guys for Malkin. They've got two budding lines of skill players; if they ditch Kopitar and Brown from Malkin, they're down to one.

I really want Hossa to stay and maybe that has skewed my thinking into believing that he really might stay. But I'm not sure. If he does, let's say I will still be very pleasantly surprised, mainly because I agree with what you say - the best way to build a team is right down the middle - Crosby, Malkin, Staal and Fleury.

Crosby and Malkin will be this generation's Sakic-Forsberg, Gretzky-Messier and Yzerman-Federov. Staal will never be a playmaking center and he'll never create offense the same way, but as long as he's lining up at center, the Pens have three lines that will be able to generate points - two lines off of skill and precision and a third that generates points out of physicality and work ethic. If keeping that together for the next five or six years costs us Hossa, I can live with it.

Victor Raison said...

I can't bash golf. Through some mutation of genetic programming, I enjoy playing. Perhaps it is a testament to my character that I suck at it. However, the more I play, the more I see that the people who take it seriously tend to be a group of maladjusted, narcissistic neanderthals. (Chad Hermann, anyone?) They don't seem to realize that they play the game that real sports play in the off-season. That's why I took issue with Tigger Woods receiving Athlete of the Year accolades a few years ago. I mean, c'mon, seriously? Oh well, I guess if you can't beat 'em, beat 'em. Literally.

*pulls out 9-iron*

Flyer Hater said...

Here is the lineup I'd like to see next year, all feedback is welcome. Except from BNG66, woooo.

Straka-Crosby-Hossa
Stillman-Malkin-Sykora
Ruutu-Staal-Kennedy
Hall-Talbot-Stone

Scuderi-Gonchar
Commodore-Whitney
Gill-Letang

Conklin
Fleury

Conklin gets the start because his puckhandling abilities once cured baby Jesus.

Max Power said...

@ flyer hater

Boooooooooo. Straka? Commodore? What? Why would we waste money on them?

Lady Jaye said...

I can watch golf... don't mean I like golf unless it involves windmills and water falls.

I like how there is suddenly this golf vs hockey debate when it's like comparing sticks and stones... and speaking of stones, hockey fans tend to be more intelligent than fans of many other sports and all sports have some fans that are dumber than rocks... but maybe that is the homer hockey fan in me.

dying alive said...

I can't wait until free agent signings are over with. Listening to the media spew guesses as factual evidence that they heard from a "reliable inside source" for weeks on end makes me want to projectile vomit.

So does Krista. She looks pretty much exactly how I expected she would - bad blonde haircut and giant white teeth. Yee haw.

Colin said...

@ stoosh -

With the chance that both Malone and Roberts are out of the picture for 2008-09, Staal becomes the logical choice to be the player that gets his ass kicked in front of the net on the power play. And there are few players on this team better at shoveling garbage than Staal.

Exactly. See game two against the Rangers.

I agree with you about keeping Hossa. I want to see him in the Black and Gold next year. Even if it costs us Malone and possible Orpik. God, I love both of those two guys, but I think that they are the most replaceable.

However, should it ever come down to Hossa or Malkin, you have to take Malkin.

I think if you can keep the Hossa-Sid and Malkin-Sykie combinations together, with Fleury in net, you have a chance to do something special.

demondg1 said...

Canadian media = Maple sucking moose fuckers

That's awesome.

Joose said...

rantblog

So, these people come into the financial aid office I work in at least once or twice a week (for the past couple of months), and they talk about how they are going to split one of the rooms into two separate offices when the Academic Advising department moves in here and Financial Aid gets shipped over to join forces with the Registrar.
Every damn time, they say the same thing, and they speak as loudly as possible: "We're putting a wall here. This will be a hallway." Then, they turn the lights off and on to see how they will need to rewire shit when they split the room. Today, they brought a ladder, and some joke just came in and turned off the AC in my separate section in the office (after I slammed the door to have some peace, of course). This all occurs during office hours, obviously, and I am becoming increasingly annoyed by it.

They just opened the door right now and are bringing the ladder into my room.

ANNOYED.

/end rant

odmE. said...

@ lady jaye - actually, of all pro sports, hockey fans are the highest educated and most affluent. I wish I fell into the "most affluent" category, but I can at least consider myself pretty well educated...

Golf sucks, the end.

Unrelatedblog, today I discovered that roasted salted almonds + hot Hungarian paprika + a ziploc bag and a good shake = pretty much the most delicious snack ever. Thank Gary for Hungarian gramas...

Free Candy Man (formerly nathan) said...

I like Mike Commodore, and if some team ever gave him #64, I would buy that jersey in a heartbeat (even if it were the Flyers -- I think the awesomeness of a "COMMODORE 64" jersey would outweigh the Flyers part of it), but the Pens already have a huge, less-than-mobile defenseman signed through next season. He's the USS Hal Gill. So the only way I'd take Commodore is if Gill leaves.

TheNWChica said...

So Max...is it the pudgy in the pudgy girl from TX that you don't like or the fact that she's a douche?

I'm a pudgy chick who's not only way cuter than her, but I could outeat her and I like Pittsburgh.

Lady Jaye said...

@joose > I feel your pain. Our lovely realty management people had an A/C leak in our server room and destroy one of our T1 lines... and destroy one of our servers... they better be paying the $5000 it cost to recover the data.

They had to do some rewiring somewhere for something and just pounded away and drilled for hours and hours... nice part is that our building has a sleep lab below it. I don't think anybody was sleeping ;)

I don't understand why they just don't have people work on stuff like that during a 'night shift' so we can work... and it would also be awesome if our cleaning people would remember to take out the trash and vacuum this week.

I'm having all sorts of frustrationblog at work this week.

Stoosh said...

Golfblog...

I enjoy playing golf even though I suck; I'm usually thrilled to death if I hit a drive off the tee into the air. If I do the same thing with a fairway wood shot, I'm amazed.

I'll watch golf on TV from time to time, especially if there's a major on, but I'm not sure I'd call myself an active fan.

Howevahhhhhhhh (Stephen A. Smith),

In terms of golf, there is NAHHHTHING worse than going out golfing with a group of people who are just out there to have fun, and then having to deal with the one asshat who took lessons and makes sure to rub it in everyone's face when he's kicking your ass all over the course. He's the recreational golfer's equivalent of Softball Guy.

When I was still living in Erie, I used to golf every weekend or so with three other guys from high school. One of them was Golfer Guy. If we played eighteen, by the time we made the turn, at least one of us who wasn't Golfer Guy was ready to wrap a club or four around the neck of Golfer Guy. He took it way too seriously; he'd throw his clubs if he messed up a shot...that kind of stuff that makes it less fun for everyone else.

After getting sick of reminding him that we're all just out to have fun, we stopped calling him and telling him when we were golfing.

Max Power said...

@ thenwchica

Tis because she's a douche. I'm relatively fat (i.e. a few steps above pudgy) so I can job on chunks like myself. Especially if they're from TX.

TheNWChica said...

Cool....just checking. *passes you some cheese fries*

Max Power said...

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhgggggggggrrrrrrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm cheese.

Party of Ruutu said...

Some of those articles were nauseating.

That last Yinz Luv 'Da Guins was fantastico.

Ha. Golf.

Joose said...

Lady Jaye - I don't even mind that they are in here too much. They are doing their jobs and blah blah. What pisses me off is that they don't have the courtesy to say, "Excuse us. We are going to look at this and that so we can do this and that." When the joke turned my air conditioning off, he didn't say one word to me. He just did it and calmly closed the door. I did't even get a fucking, "Hello. How are you?" from anyone.
Three of them just stood around talking about Sheetz and how you can order food at the pump. Gee whiz! What a time saver!


R
E
S
P
E
C
T

haha

They are gone now, so I'm cool.

Colin said...

Is there anyone that is bored today that could possibly do a photoshop project for me. I guarentee it will be very easy. I just need to transpose some logos and changes some colors on a few jerseys to get some ideas for my adult league team. I will reward you handsomly for it.

Dr. Turkleton said...

me thinks we got jobbed [HARD] by tPB staff in cblog 1.5 hours ago...and no reaction from cblog????

love golf
love playing golf
love watching golf
├╝ber-hate Tiger Woods



US Open:

KJ Choi: FTW [only cause I have $ involved]
Padraig Harrington: for realz.

sorry Rachele,Rachele.


Malkin for Kopitar AND Brown....

hmmmmmm............

big props go out to that Dead Wing fan who turned Greentree into a No-Drive Zone yesterday.....dick.

Colin said...

lee p. = tPB staff?

Say what?

Dr. Turkleton said...

oops...

almost forgot.

Malone and/or Orpiks rights to C-Bus for some picks [including 6th overall]

double, hmmmmmmm.......



[Hossa: 19:9]

Joose said...

If I had to choose between watching a few hours of golf and scooping my eyes out with plastic spoons....guess which one I'd choose.

RaCHeLeYoS said...

Dr. T - Nick Dougherty....

he will prob fail but I'll still root for him. HA.... Angel Cabrera? negative. He won last year.

Dr. Turkleton said...

colin

The Orange Crush = we: fail.

2008WingsParade = we: epic fail.

that's what I think.



[Hossa: 19:9]

Joose said...

Oh, I must say, though, that I am a big fan of mini golf. I would annihilate everyone..

..or at least get second or third place.

Stilly said...

Lookingaheadblog

I know people really want Hossa to come back. It certainly would be nice, but here's the rub.

In the 2009-2010 you will potentially have three people (Bing, Geno, Hossa) making over 8 mil a piece. We would have to toss everyone else to keep those three players together, and fill out the lineup with scrubs and rookies. That certainly not a smart move.

Come season after next, you'd almost have to trade Sid, Geno, or Hossa. Sid isn't going anywhere. So the question is this..

Would you keep Hossa or Malkin?

Personally, I keep Malkin and try to get another winger for Sid. I would look into getting Jordan Staal off the third line if he's that big of a deal. Either put him on the wing of the first line or move Geno up to 1st line wing and let Staal work with Syko. There's also the trade market, but what pieces are there?

Prediction: Shero lets Hossa walk this season.

Party of Ruutu said...

Almost an hr. later, I finally get the Kronwall joke.

I suppose it's hard to get penis jokes if you don't have one.

Dr. Turkleton said...

stephen s.

excellent work.

love 'the Pensblog' brand on the can of whatev at the beach.

still can't figure out what's playing on the ipod, though...

Rex Gildo, perhaps?


[Hossa: 19:9]

odmE. said...

@ joose - I, too, love me some mini golf. The last time I played, I was wearing heels and still managed to own everyone.

@ stilly - You've thrown in some good points there. I'd really like to see Hossa stay at least another season, but in all reality, Malkin gets the vote hands-down between the two of them. Investment-wise, it's a much more solid plan to keep Malkin, who has so much more ahead of him (which methinks someone else already said).

I'm trying to not speculate too much. My major concerns are Malone and Orpik at this point, but, like everyone, I must wait and see what transpires...

wilsmith said...

Orpik and Malone wont let themselves be traded to Columbus. Epic waste of a career.

Hopefully they find themselves out west.

Remember, ex-Pens turn into Penguin killers.

Free Candy Man (formerly nathan) said...

Which is why Shero needs to trade Hossa (if he does trade Hossa) to a Western Conference team, so the Pens only get killed once (maybe twice) a season.

xuscbausp said...

soccerblog

1-1? wow i missed a lot of action in the first 20 minutes

Stilly said...

Deco slotted home early and Libor Sionko levelled around min 17. I was listening to it on Sirius, but I couldn't sit in my car all afternoon.. there's work to be done.. lol.

xuscbausp said...

wow ryan malone is playing D out there

ouch

Raybin said...

Sooooooooo...

Figure a 55 million dollar cap.

per the Sporting News article I linked in the last Cblog:

The Penguins have about $34 million committed to 13 players. Sidney Crosby leads the list at $8.7 million, followed by defensemen Sergei Gonchar ($5 million), Ryan Whitney ($4 million) and center Evgeni Malkin ($3.8 million).

21 million left.

Think defense first: Gill, Letang, Gonch, Whitney, Scuds and Orpik. Alex Goligoski in WBS. That leaves Sydor and Eaton as odd men out. There's an extra 4 million right there. 25 million.

Figure the conventional wisdom is right and Fleury is worth 5 million, and Malone 4. and let's say Hossa takes a slight cut at 6 million a year. That's 15 gone, which leaves us with 10 to sign a bunch of players. But who?

A lot of it's going to depend on who's willing to take a cut.

If Laraque drops to a million instead of 1.2 a year, you can sign him. If Lord Gary stays around for 2 million instead of 2.5, that's a 700,000 dollar savings. Which sounds about the right amount to keep Ty Conklin. You can then bid farewell to Sabourin.

With Ryan Stone, Chris Minard and Nathan Smith all waiting in the wings in WBS and presumably able to be re-signed on the (comparatively) cheap, you can probably bid godspeed to Adam Hall and Pascal Dupuis and save some money that way.

You can snag Ruutu at a million a year, maybe. Free Candy for 2.5?

I've lost track of my math. Am I in under the cap? And how much does Geno's extension complicate things? Am I just fucking nuts? Don't answer that last question.

Pensgirl said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Jersey Bill said...

I know a guy, who knows a guy, who knows a guy who said that chick is a whore.

FA this summer is going to force me to vomitblog.

Pensgirl said...

I am so hating blogger right now.

One of the reasons I've never cared for golf is the absolute snobbery that so many golfers display. They look down their noses at the rest of the world, which is hilarious considering they're wearing the most hideous outfits ever put together. By saying "all hockey fans are dumb" that idiot not only ignores the facts about hockey fans, he also relies on an utter lack of knowledge about what it takes to follow hockey and a full belief in stereotypes that have to do with the fighting aspects of the sport.

I would put up any random hockey fan against that guy in a wits-based competition. But since he's evidently a golf blogger, let's pit him against Dr. Mirtle. Any takers as to who'd win on that?

And as if he didn't already prove his snobbery and absolute dickishness, he goes on to say Canadians are inherently stupid? Well, if they're dumb that's looking bad for us, because Canada ranked 4th on the UN's Human Development Index, which measures "knowledge" (proxied by educational factors) among other things, and the U.S. is 12th. So if Canadians are dumb I'd hate to hear what that makes us.

RedWings said...

wilsmith said...
Orpik and Malone wont let themselves be traded to Columbus. Epic waste of a career.

Hopefully they find themselves out west.

Remember, ex-Pens turn into Penguin killers.

6/11/2008 12:10 PM


Detroit's in the West. I'd gladly welcome them to Motown. Although with Orpik, the Wings are pretty deep on the blue line, if they are able to re-sign Stuart.

And after watching Malone's Game 5 performance, I'm a HUGE fan.

And thanks to Tiger Woos' anti-hockey comments, I'll now root that he never breaks Jack's Major record.

Stilly said...

Nice post raybin.

Ruutu is currently hitting the cap for 1.1. So he'd have to take a slight paycut to re-sign for a mil. I think he would command more than a million on the market. I would put him in the 2-2.5 mil range. I'd also project Orpik higher. Somewhere between 3.5 and 4 on the market.

The rest of the math works out, even considering the higher price for Ruu and Orpik. The big determining factor will be getting people to take less. No way does Hossa take a penny under what he currently gets now (7 mil) He'll be willing to offer a discount, but it'll be in the 7.5 mil range.

Geno's deal will complicate things the next year. That's when his 8-9 mil will hit the cap. If I'm Ray Shero, i either sign Hossa to a one year 7.5 or 8 million dollar deal, or trade his rights. Shero definitely does not want to have three players making 8 mil year after next.

Trading the rights to Hossa for picks is probably the way to go. I realize that puts us right back to where we were pre-hossa, but that's the result of a salary cap.

xuscbausp said...

i cant do offseasonblog. at least not yet. im just not good at speculating. besides, nothing i say will keep or get rid of anybody.

as for golfblog: there are plenty of us out there who enjoy both games. people who are snobs towards one of the other are just morons. i, for one, can't wait to start watching the US Open. the comment about Canada is also simply ridiculous. some people shouldnt be allowed to use computers.

rantblog finished

Sooska said...

@will smith: Orpik and Malone wont let themselves be traded to Columbus.

I don't think they have much say. Shero doesn't need their permission.

@dr turk -Also if you read Faceoff Factor- the supposed deal for negotation rights for Malone & Orpik is probably the 19th pick, not the 6th.

Pens & Blue Jackets?

Pensgirl said...

Sooska, that guy's on crack if you ask me (the Columbus reporter guy, not the FF guy). Shero would potentially give up Orpik and Malone for the 19th pick? No way. I know this draft is supposed to be deep but you don't give up two solid players for one mid-rounder. I'd say for both those guys you want the 6th and a second-rounder (maybe early third). But I don't think Orpik's rights will be dealt...he's still the guy who I think will be easiest to sign.

debrisslide said...

Golf is no fun to watch. The end. The fact that anyone watches it boggles my mind. I can see how it would be fun to play, though.

I'm not so much into keeping Laraque. I love him dearly but I haven't been too impressed this year. Getting rid of him should free up some cool money, in my opinion--make it easier to keep people who have been more productive. Woo?

Colin said...

Ronaldogoalblog

Stilly said...

Deco has been a beast today. 1G 1A.

Colin said...

I hope Deco doesn't go to Chelsea.

Sooska said...

pensgirl- agreed. no way he'd lose both for one pick. UNLESS they have him over a barrel. I think it's like a poker game at this point- maybe Texas Hold 'em. We know the flop, turn and river are Hossa, Malone and Orpik but which order and what's the bet?

Is that strained or what?

xuscbausp said...

theyve had chances to tie this one. still a good amount of time but they gotta push it quickly.

also, this ronaldo guy is pretty good. he been around long?

Dr. Turkleton said...

last year, NSH dealt Hartnell & Timonnens rights to PHI for a 1st rounder [23rd overall, which was NSH's pick originally they sent to PHI for Forsberg]
I think those 2 are comparable as a pair to #12 & #44.

thanks for the FF article, sooska...I didn't realize C-Bus has the 19th overall as well...

If King Shero realizes he can't sign either [or choses not to], AND be able to swing the 6th pick instead of zilch after July 1st, he'd be crazy not to pull the trigger & go ALL IN !!!!! Settling for 'only' the #19 overall wouldn't be a bad option as compared to the worst case scenario [getting bupkis & not signing either]

BTW, nice poker reference, Jennifer Tilly!!!


[Hossa: 19:9]

Colin said...

@ xuscbaup-

sarcasmblog?

Katie said...

golfblog - I like golf, but only if I'm playing and there is a beer cart involved. I can watch snippets on tv.

As for who will be here and who will be gone, I can't even begin to wrap my head around that one. I do, however, have faith that whatever happens will work out fine. Call me the eternal optimist.

xuscbausp said...

mad sarcasmblog

Colin said...

@ katie -

I too agreed. I don't know if it is so much as optimism, but the fact that Shero has not made one bad move to date. Maybe Sydor? Hard to argue though. I have faith in King Ray.

Colin said...

I figured as much.

Sooska said...

@dr turk- thanks and you're welcome.
King Rayis exploring alloptions and hopefull will succeed in avoiding any of them going to a divisional opponent (hello Craig Patrick) which would be horrible.

BlacknGold66 said...

Damn you FlyerHater!!!

::shakes fist::

BlacknGold66 said...

@Colin: You still need Photoshop work to be done?

Pensgirl said...

Turk I wouldn't really compare the Nashville situation b/c they were sort of having a fire sale last summer. And while you're right that some value is better than no value, I still say just getting the 19th for the two of them isn't enough. The only way I'd make that move is at the 11th hour (like Hossa-deal-late). But I sort of see it as an exercise in futility anyway because I still think Orpik is likely to re-sign.

Colin said...

@ bng66 -

Yeah, it is super easy I swear. I am just an idiot when it comes to that stuff.

Jasper said...

rumors can actually be very funny to read, some jerks write some shit
I guess there's a reason why it's called a rumor
I only believe it when trades are actually made and when I actually hear players say stuff themselves

BlacknGold66 said...

@Colin: Shoot me an email. It's in my profile.

Max Power said...

Eagle River

Pensgirl said...

(I should clarify that I'm assuming Columbus would basically have the chips in place to immediately sign both players if they were really gonna do a last-minute trade. Since the reason the Columbus-type in such a trade would do it is a high confidence they could actually sign the players, and realistically you know that comes from talking to agents....)

BNG, you reminded me I forgot to comment on FH's lineup. I just have one point on that...

Straka was my favorite Penguin for many years, but I wouldn't want to take a chance on him now. Remember, Mark Recchi could still play in 06/07. We all thought re-signing him was a good move last summer. For me, the lesson in that is I would be really hesitant to sign an older guy as a winger for Sid. Roberts types, sure. But top-six forward? Hmmm, not so much.

Colin said...

@ bng66 -

Done.

wilsmith said...

sooska - the only way orpik or malone gets traded to CBJ is if they sign a contract that allows the trade to go through. by having their rights traded, they're only giving CBJ the right to negotiate with them before July 1. If they get a deal, THEN the trade goes through.

So yeah, if they don't want to go to CBJ, they're not going to.

also, no one at Hossa's age and talent level is going to sign a 1 year deal.

Dr. Turkleton said...

pensgirl

I agree with you that NSH was having a mini fire sale last year due to ownership issues and the subsequent result of that was to: get/keep the payroll down.

despite that, I think comparing the situations in which the deals were [could be] made are very similar.

NSH wasn't going to pay the exorbitant amount of $ that Hartnell & Timonnen were asking for, that PHI gladly paid [overpaid, IMO] PHI, seeing NSH's back up against the wall, forfeited that 23rd overall pick...

Now, the Pens, obviously, aren't in cutting payroll mode [thanks, Mario!]
BUT. with their cap issues: this is where the similar, back up against the wall, fits in.

Maybe it won't be Malone and/or Orpik, but I feel somewhere down the line, a UFA will have to dealt for a player or a draft pick...at the expense of losing them for nada....

funny while looking at the rest of the NSH firesale, they traded their starting goalie Volkoun [Fleury] for draft picks and weren't able to sign or get anything for one of the biggest UFA's on the market in Kariya [Hossa]



[Hossa: 19:9]

Stilly said...

@wilsmith

Totally agree. Which is why Hossa won't be returning. Unless he WANTS to be a mercenary for a year, he'll be too pricey.

wilsmith said...

I just dont any of them in the east.
Brooks' lack of scoring is a recipe for a 3 goal night every time he plays the Pens.

wilsmith said...

I also like to leave out relatively important words, in case you didn't already notice.

'want', maybe?

Max Power said...

Just for the strangeness of it:

MSN:
Cuba approves sex change operations
Country's health care system will offer procedures free of charge

Joose said...

What ever happened to Celebrity Poker Showdown?

Stilly said...

Wow I'm reading a list of UFA's for the upcoming season and they list Malone as the 4th rated UFA in the NHL. Hossa, of course, is 1st.

Here's a question, if paried with Crosby, is Malone capable of Hossa-ish numbers?

Pensgirl said...

Turk I have a weird take on Malone.

Since his son was born I've thought he might be one of the more likely to go. I can really just see him putting more emphasis on the money when he stares at his little boy (the thoughts start rolling in..."What if I get hurt? What else would I do for money? I have to be able to take care of him..."). Being home with him more now that the season is over I can see that drum beating even louder.

But what that would mean is not that he wants to leave us so much as he wants to test the open market, in which case another team wouldn't have incentive to trade for him anyway (unless they were prepared to offer something of Lowesian proportions, I guess).

Raybin said...

@joose

Phil Gordon left as host and Phill Hellmuth took over. Which resulted, unsurprisingly, in people not watching. They were ribbing him about it one night on Poker After Dark. Funny stuff.

That and the general comedown that poker has had since the boom of 2003-2006.

Raybin said...

@stilly

Can I have the link for that list? Curiousityblog

Victor Raison said...

All this FA talk is giving me the same feeling in the pit of my stomach that I had before Game 1 of the SCF. I gotta stop thinking about it or I won't be able to eat for a month.

Joose said...

Raybin

I loved that show. Poker After Dark is completely miserable.

Stilly said...

The site is called Sports City

Linky-Link

Pensgirl said...

Stilly I don't think Bugsy quite has the hands for those numbers, but he's one (despite what I said above) I'd try hard to keep because we don't have any other big wingers who are capable of regular top-line duty. And if we could pull off re-signing him I said the other day I would put him on Sid's line. I thought he and Hossa were fast enough that they didn't need speed and energy from their other linemate (no offense to Dupuis because he really did help create that 'bees around the hive' thing they had going); I think they could have used more crash-bang.

Raybin said...

@joose

That's interesting because I love Poker After Dark. (Tastes...they do vary!) I like the pros just sitting around bullshitting and telling stories.

The main attraction though is the pros themselves. It's why I'm very ambivalent about most episodes of the World Poker Tour. Too many amateurs, most of whom make me want to take a Black and Decker drill to my eyeball.

I will say I want to pay someone to beat Ali Nejad to death with a wrench. Can't stand him.

My #1-with-a-bullet show is High Stakes Poker, though.

Stilly said...

@pensgirl

If Hossa goes and Malone stays, does the organizaion still need to pickup a winger fill Hossa's role?

Pensgirl said...

Hm, after looking at the full list I'm gonna backpedal on Straka a bit. For some reason I had it in my head he was 36, but he's not even 35 'til September. He might be an OK signing for a year or two...but I wouldn't necessarily put him with Sid. If we had a bigger winger to stick on that line I'd rather see that.

Pensgirl said...

Stilly I'd say yes.

Raybin said...

@stilly

Thanks!

Random other teams free agents thoughts:

You have to figure the Sharks will do their best to re-sign Campbell. I don't know what their cap situation is though.

Huet stays with the Caps. No brainer there.

Detroit locks down Stuart for sure. Also, Nashville will (or should) make Dan Ellis their franchise goaltender.

Curious to see where old warhorses like Jagr and Sundin end up.

Forsberg too...sure he's only 33, but his body is like 80.

Stoosh said...

Given that this is Hossa's first and potentially last chance to cash in big on free agency and that he's coming off a very productive playoff run that may have put to rest most of the questions about his postseason character, there is absolutely no way Hossa signs a one or two-year deal.

I can see the rationale behind it - basically sign the deal, play with Crosby for one or two seasons, hopefully have a couple of huge years, win a Cup or two and then cash in one or two years down the road.

One problem that's throw a monkeywrench in the whole thing, and this is what his agent will use to sell him on the long-term deal:

If he suffers any sort of a serious injury during that time, he loses. He'll NEVER recoup in free agency a year or two from now what he could've potentially made this summer under a long-term deal.

His agent will probably not even have to go that far to convince him. There's simply this: The 2008 version of Marian Hossa has a lot more earning power on the market than would the 2009 or 2010 versions of Marian Hossa. The 2009 and 2010 versions would be a year or two older...a year or two closer to peaking...a year or two closer to the twilight of their careers. He'd be a lot less likely to convince teams to take a chance on a long-term investment in him when he's 30 going on 31 or 31 going on 32, as opposed to 29 going on 30.

That's why Hossa's going to try to get as much as he can for as long as he reasonably can now. The only thing he's going to have to answer for himself is how much the money and security means versus how much the chance to win means.

Raybin said...

Question for the floor:

Depending on who stays and who goes, do the Pens look at Prospal for the second or third lines?

Pensgirl said...

Raybin I'm pretty sure Forsberg looks like Pigpen when he walks around, only instead of a dirt cloud he's actually kicking up a cloud of "dust" from his bones crumbling.

(Can you all tell I'm home sick today with nothing better to do than sit here and refresh every 10 seconds?)

Stilly said...

@raybin

I think they have to at least make an offer. Prospal had 71 points in 80 regular season games, and I'm sure his production would be up playing with Geno, and he's younger and more productive than Straka if one were inclined to go that route. He was only 1.9 mil against the cap this year. So I'd say 2-2.5 would be fair for him. It'd be a steal for that kind of production.

Stoosh said...

@ Raybin -

Prospal has always intrigued me a bit because he seems like the type who could've been a consistent 30-goal, 80-point guy if he really wanted to. But damn, he was pretty invisible in that Pens-Flyers series and didn't seem to show any life until Game Four. He's always seemed a bit underwhelming to me, but the problem is that you could also say that about a few of the other guys that we might be looking at in free agency (Ryder, Huselius).

Nevertheless, he was almost a point-a-game player for Tampa this past year (57 points in 62 games) and he kept up that pace after getting dealt to Philly (14 points in 18 reg. season games and then 13 points in 17 playoff games).

His career numbers - 179 goals in 792 career reg. season games - means he scores at a pace (.23 goals per game) that would net him an average of 18-19 goals per 82-game season.

For what Prospal might make, I might rather have Ryder. Ryder's got 207 points in 314 career games, he's been a consistent 55-point-a-year guy. Even better, he's scored about 25-27 goals per 82-game season (99 goals in 314 games). And he's five years younger than Prospal.

JYo said...

Given that this is Hossa's first and potentially last chance to cash in big on free agency and that he's coming off a very productive playoff run that may have put to rest most of the questions about his postseason character, there is absolutely no way Hossa signs a one or two-year deal.

Again, I could not agree more with you Stoosh. I tried to argue the same point a few days back and was basically berated for it. Albeit, you do it in a far more eloquent way.

Raybin said...

@stoosh

Sick anticipation! Ryder was my next question.

I'd say Prospal for sure, for all the reasons stilly put forth, but for the whole age thing.

Wouldn't complain to see either one around if a roster spot opens up if Hall or Ruutu or Dupuis depart.

If Dupuis leaves, who goes on the first line? If Malone leaves, who on the second? And what if both do?

Would not want to be Shero right now.

Colin said...

Personally, I think Ryder would explode in the 'burg. He is a more of a pure finished and is younger than Prospal.

I think he would love Pittsburgh after being in the pressure cooker of MTL.

J.S. said...

Ryder, from what I remember reading around the deadline, is absolute garbage on the backcheck and had a rep for getting lazy.

If he were to come to Pittsburgh, it better be with a cheap price tag.

Raybin said...

Agreed that Hossa signs a four or five year deal or is in the wind by July 1.

Malone's fate will be the opposite of Hossa's....one stays, the other goes. Nothing novel about that insight, of course.

If Shero pulls off the miracle and lands Hossa for that long, I will genuflect before him. I'd be all for it too....I really think the Pens could get some serious stuff from Columbus for Bugsy...he'd be just what they need. (Among several things, anyway)

Sooska said...

@wilsmith- You said they "won't let themselves be traded to Columbus". My point was they have no contractural right to refuse any destination unless Shero affords a professional courtesy to either of them by asking where they'd like to go. It is doubtful that he has that flexibility.

The closer it gets to July 1 the less flexibility he will have in getting a rights trade or similar.

Raybin said...

@pensgirl

An insult to Forsberg and a Peanuts reference in one?

Unreal!

Pensgirl said...

I'd at least agree to give Prospal a look. To compare, Hossa put up .92 PPG in the regular season and Prospal put up .89. For the salary difference, I'd take that drop in production. But Stoosh, I noticed the same thing you did about the playoffs (his playoff production dropped to .76 PPG)...while Hossa proved that "playoff disappearing act" can sometimes be attributed improperly, it's something to consider.

Stilly said...

@raybin

I'd like to have Hossa back too, but the Pens can't take on a multi-year 7.5-8 million dollar deal and sign Malkin to the ridiculous money he's going to get. Since Malkin will only make 3.2 or whatever this coming year, it wouldn't be a problem, but the next year would be hell. We wouldn't be able to sign anyone for more than 2 or 3 mil to fill in the roster.

I suppose the question is whether you want to build a juggernaut for 4 or five years or play for the cup next year.

Raybin said...

@stilly

Crap.

I always forget about Malkin's looming extension when figuring on these things.

Pensgirl said...

Thanks Raybin! I've never liked Forsberg, so it's fun for me. :)

Stilly said...

@raybin

Just when you think you have the cap math figured out, you remember something else.. haha.

That's why we pay king Shero the big bucks.

Raybin said...

And I will say give me the 5 year juggernaut over the 1 year "super team"

Don't want to turn into the 1994 Rangers or the 2004 Lightning.

Stilly said...

Totally agree raybin.

I say trade Hossa's rights or let him walk. It's just hard to imagine a replacement for someone who fit so well. Bing makes those around him better. I'll take someone who wasn't as productive as Hossa with the reassaurance that playing with Crosby will help their stats.

Quingo77 said...

I hate to say this but I've been telling friends this for awhile. Malkin reminds me a lil of the bad side of Jagr. It hurst to say that (so i hope I'm wrong). Having said that, when he fled Russia and first came to the U.S. (in L.A.) he gave his first interview and he raved a lot about living and loving that area of the country. Just a connection, but I could see him wanting to go there.

Has anyone else noticed that Pittsburgh basically has the best overall group of free agents available?

Dr. Turkleton said...

@jyo said:
I tried to argue the same point a few days back and was basically berated for it.

correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you used the term 'low-balling' as if the cblog thought was that King Shero could sign him for below market-value. I don't recall anyone saying only signing him to a 1-2 year deal...

IF KS can sign him to a 4-5 yr deal at 6.5-7mil per...I'd say that's a steal of a deal [take the small box]

Ryder analysis per the Sports Forecaster:

ASSETS: Displays sound positioning and the ability to get into open areas to score goals. Owns a lethal shot from the slot area and a goal-scorer's mentality.
FLAWS: Needs to make better use of his linemates. Lacks defensive polish. Isn't a very physical player, and isn't able to create his own shot.
CAREER POTENTIAL: Second line right wing.

meh. If KS can get him on the cheap, [2-2.5mil / yr]...that's the only way I see him coming on borad.


[Hossa: 19:9]

JYo said...

One option for Hossa is to sign him to the big deal then trade him after next season before they have to pay Malkin. That is pretty risky though since there is no guarantee anyone would take him at a high salary next year.

What about Naslund? I don't know how much he was making and what he is looking for, but I'd imagine he could be a very productive winger for Sid.

Matt Gajtka said...

Hey guys, is there anyone in cblog who can give me some pointers as far as creating and embedding a podcast on a Blogger site?

If so, shoot me an email at matt.gajtka@gmail.com.

Thanks!
GO PENS (and Buccos too)

JYo said...

correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you used the term 'low-balling' as if the cblog thought was that King Shero could sign him for below market-value. I don't recall anyone saying only signing him to a 1-2 year deal...

OK, I'll correct you. Several people tried to argue that Hossa would accept a 1-2 year deal to try to win a Cup since that would somehow make him more valuable on the open market after that. Like Stoosh, I argued that there is no guarantee that he will be able to get that money in a few years and he would be foolish not to take it now, but people kept arguing that a Cup would raise his value almost no matter what.

There was a separate issue about him accepting less money to stay here, which is somewhat related, but nonetheless a separate issue. I don't recall ever using the term "low balling," but some people seem to think he will take a "hometown discount" and suggest things like a $6 million per year deal. To me, that would be "low balling." He already makes $7 mil a year and is likely going to get offers of $8-9 mil a year. A "hometown discount" may be in the $8-8.5 mil a year range.

My point the whole time was that if the Pens do sign him, other people are going to have to leave. Some folks were suggesting that Hossa, Bugsy, Orpik, etc. were all going to take some form of suboptimal deals to keep this team together and I still do not believe that is realistic at all. As was pointed out today, Hossa is in a place to get his one huge pay day and Malone is in a position to make his family set for life. Why would these guys just give that up? As much as they want to win a Cup, I can not believe that hockey would come before their family, which they can make financially secure for generations with a big deal this year.

Stoosh said...

@ Pensgirl -

I'd at least agree to give Prospal a look. To compare, Hossa put up .92 PPG in the regular season and Prospal put up .89. For the salary difference, I'd take that drop in production. But Stoosh, I noticed the same thing you did about the playoffs (his playoff production dropped to .76 PPG)...while Hossa proved that "playoff disappearing act" can sometimes be attributed improperly, it's something to consider.

The thought of Prospal intrigues me more and more. He might be the guy this year who is closest to what Sykora was when we got him - a bit of an enigma and kind of a streaky scorer.

To be honest, I thought his 13 points in 17 playoff games this year was fairly impressive, especially considering the Pens contained him fairly well. Most players see a drop in scoring in the post-season because the games tighten up and teams take fewer chances, so the dropoff from .89 ppg to .76 ppg in the postseason isn't a terrible one.

The keys are finding guys who don't show that dramatic dropoff, although that can also be misleading because it depends on the role the player had with each team. This is why so many media types were quick to point out Hossa's playoff performance when he had more prominent roles on some of those Ottawa teams...he wasn't nearly as bad as the reputation that unfortunately preceded him.

Matt Gajtka said...

Only and last word on golfblog from me: I love to play golf more than any other sport besides hockey (ice or street, it doesn't matter). I have also been a huge fan of Tiger since he started; he's one of the main reasons I started playing, probably second only to my grandfather showing me the way.

All that being said, I was floored when Tiger made his comments. The guy follows the Michael Jordan mode in that he goes out of his way to avoid offending any segment of the public. To hear him be so condescending toward my sport was shocking and infuriating. I root for him every time he plays, but it's gonna be weird when the U.S. Open starts tomorrow. Don't know if I can be a Tiger fan now...at least for the foreseeable future.

uncleyorgi71 said...

@quingo

There is no comparison between Jagr and MALKIN. Jagr didn't break 100 points in a season until 95-96. In his first two seasons with the PENS he had 57 then 69 points respectively. MALKIN has had 85 then 106. MALKIN is a shooter AND a play maker. It took Jagr 5 years to break 40 goals in a season when he had 62 goals and 87 assist in 95-96 which is undoubtedly the best season of hockey he has ever played. This was also the first season that he was nominated as a Hart Trophy Finalist It only took MALKIN two to complete each task. MALKIN reminds me more of LEMIEUX. The only thing that Jagr has on MALKIN is a cup in his second year. So what, MALKIN will get one in his third.

Stoosh said...

@ Raybin -

I'd say Prospal for sure, for all the reasons stilly put forth, but for the whole age thing. Wouldn't complain to see either one around if a roster spot opens up if Hall or Ruutu or Dupuis depart.

If Dupuis leaves, who goes on the first line? If Malone leaves, who on the second? And what if both do?


Dupuis I think is miscast as a top-line winger. Love his speed, but ideally, I'd rather see him on the third or fourth line.

If he leaves and Malone stays, I keep Malone on the second line with Geno and Skyie. My in-house options to replace the first-line LW would be:

1. Talbot - He's got skills and I could see him becoming kind of a Jason Blake sans the asstastic tendencies Blake seems to show once in a while. He brings tons of speed, and adding his wheels to a line that could conceivably have Sid and Hossa or someone like Prospal, Huselius or Ryder could be sick. He embraces every role he's ever been given. The only concern would be his size; can he hold up over the course of a year?

2. Staal - Would be a temporary filler for a year or so until someone from the system is ready (Caputi, Pierro-Zabotel, etc). Would also need to move Max up to center the third line, which wouldn't be a problem. Staal played so well on a wing with Malkin in 06-07, this would be worth a look.

3. Free agent LW - Kristian Huselius, Matt Cooke, Markus Naslund, Martin Rucinsky, Cory Stillman...or, dare I say...even Brendan Shanahan (he can finish).
********

If Malone leaves but Dupuis stays, I'd consider playing Dupuis on the second line, moving either Max or Staal up, or bringing in a free agent as outlined above.
*********

If both leave, well...hmmm. Max and Staal both get a look to fill at least one wing. At least one free agent LW is brought in. Either Max or Staal gets one LW spot on the top two lines; whichever one doesn't get it centers the third line. Free Agent LW gets the other one.

uncleyorgi71 said...

@Matt

Dude, I am in the same boat as you. I love golf and Tiger is without a doubt the reason why I love it so much. He's like CROSBY, he changed the sport forever. When he said that though I became furious. He is suppose to be a spokesman for all sports, not just golf. He is a sports icon AND a golf icon. This is the first tournament that I am rooting against him. I hope some no name like Paul Goydos beats him.

Dr. Turkleton said...

jyo...

you're right...it was pennies on the dollar that you used.

here's the post, with you quoting sooska:

I still am not so sure he isn't going to get some exorbitant offer that will shut the Pens out.

Thank you for running realitycheckblog here the past couple of days Sooska. It seems a lot of folks around here think Hossa and others are going to take pennies on the dollar to stick around for a chance at the Cup and/or that they will take a short term deal then go get a big one. Sorry, that is not going to happen. I am sure they will take the team into consideration and perhaps take a slightly smaller deal to stick around, but they aren't going to do a 1-2 year deal worth ~$6 million per year to stay here if there is a 5-6 year deal worth ~$8 million per year to go somewhere else. That would be stupid on their part.

There are plenty of other contending type teams in the league that have money to spend. The Pens aren't going to be able to make competitive offers to all of these guys and still stay under the cap.

I don't want to run negativenancyblog here, but lets be realistic. The Pens aren't going to have the same team next year, no matter how much we want it and how much these guys talk about wanting to stay to the media. What are they going to say? "I'm taking the money and getting the hell out of here!"???

6/07/2008 1:48 PM

I still can't find anyone else bringing up 1-2 year deal other than your post...

I'm in TOTAL agreement that he wouldn't sign a 1-2 year deal, but rather hoping for a hometown discount deal [4yr 6.5-7mil] rather than your pennies on the dollar one.

[Hossa 19:9]

Pensgirl said...

JYO, I brought up 1- and 2-year contracts in general terms and you jumped to the conclusion that I must really be talking about Hossa (why I have no idea, it's not like he's our only UFA or even the only person we might want to sign). Then several people jumped in to respond to what you said...but YOU made it about him, not me. And you did also act like I (and others) meant "lowball" by "discount"...you were saying things like "Yeah Hossa will sign a 1 year deal for $3 million. Sure." No grudges, but it really was not a good way to go about having a discussion.

Stoosh, I'd probably take a chance on Prospal. For as close as his production was to Hossa's in the regular season and the difference in salary it really looks like a good deal. And if you take out our series he had 12 points in 12 playoff games.

And then there would be the fun of taking someone away from the Flyers. WOOOO

But I have to disagree with you about keeping Bugsy with Malkin if we can re-sign him. The only reason I disagree is that I think Sid's line needs more of a power-forward type. Remember how Dupuis laid that crushing hit on the right-wing boards that led directly to one of our goals? I think a player who has that built into his everyday game is so necessary on that line. And while Bugsy has great chemistry on the Malkin line, he could develop that with Sid in preseason.

But I could be sold on using Staal up there too. What I want on that line is size and the skill necessary to be a top-six forward, and Jordan certainly has both. We all saw how he did on Malkin's wing last season...that kid just always knows where to be, and that's essential to play with Sid.

Raybin said...

@stoosh

I'd be all for Talbot and Staal. Really, though, I'd think any sentient person would. :)

I'd be all for Prospal, Ryder, Huselius, Naslund, or Stillman...but I really don't think I could deal with Shanahan playing for the Penguins.

Besides, he's what, 457?

What say you of the Connor James/Chris Minard/Nathan Smith/Ryan Stone four-headed monster we saw this year? Any of those Ready For Primetime in the NHL on a line with Sid or Gino or Staal?

michelle said...

I wonder if she choked on that hamburger today

RedWings said...

uncleyorgi71 said...
@Matt

Dude, I am in the same boat as you. I love golf and Tiger is without a doubt the reason why I love it so much. He's like CROSBY, he changed the sport forever. When he said that though I became furious. He is suppose to be a spokesman for all sports, not just golf. He is a sports icon AND a golf icon. This is the first tournament that I am rooting against him. I hope some no name like Paul Goydos beats him.

6/11/2008 4:36 PM


I'd rather have Mickleson beat him head to head, because I think that would pee-off Tiger more. You know, the professional animosity and all.

Quingo77 said...

@uncleorgi71

I was referring to the off ice crap from Jagr that sometimes (I think) I see in Malkin

Your right that Malkin is much better and is more Lemieux like... make sure you read exactly what I say and not read into something that is not there. I love Malkin as his jersey is the only one I have..... I don't want him to go, but something about his personna off the ice reminds me of Jagr off the ice and I really hope I'm wrong about that perception of mine

wilsmith said...

sooska - but if the players aren't going to sign with the CBJ, then the jackets aren't going to make the trade. in effect, the players pretty much control the deal.

anyone have details on how those work? I've heard that no trade goes through unless the players will sign with the receiving team,and I also heard that the picks are conditional and there's a chance the team could end up just giving a pick away if they cant sign the player

JYo said...

Whatev. That is an old issue now. I know several people stated that they thought several players would be taking hometown discounts to keep the squad together for a run at the Cup. The reason I made the initial comment is because several people had said about players taking discounts and I can't see that many guys doing it. I don't have time to go back and find all the posts now, perhaps I will later when I have time. If you all want to keep jumping on me for it, feel free.

Pensgirl, every time you respond to one of my posts you act like I am attacking your posts. Most of my replies are at the board in general and not your posts. Sorry if you feel that way. The only time I meant to directly reply was about the 1-2 year deal comment and I used Hossa as a specific example. I could have used Malone too because I don't think either one takes a short deal and I don't believe even a Cup win could make Hossa's value any higher than it is right now.

uncleyorgi71 said...

Tiger did release a statement saying that he was just joking around. I don't buy it. Gary (God) I hope he loses.

jefe penguino said...

i had a dream that malone went to toronto. actually, it was more of a nightmare. i blame the nyquil.

uncleyorgi71 said...

@Quingo

For example...I am obsessed with MALKIN in every way. I am not afraid to admit that I have a terrible man crush on him. His heart is in the game, not the money. I don't see him turning into a douche like Jagr. I know that nobody saw it coming from Jagr either but...MALKIN jokes around alot off of the ice. He really likes the PENS. I think he respects HCMT and vice versa. Even if he did turn into a prick, I would still want to stick it in his five hole...joking. But no, I prlly would.

Pensgirl said...

JYO, I was the only person who said anything about short-term deals, and you had started out by quoting something I said directly, so yeah I did think you were continuing to talk to me. If you weren't that wasn't clear.

On Cup wins I'll just say see Gomez, Scott...frankly some of these GMs are so batshit crazy I don't know what to think they'll do anymore.

I'm actually wondering whether the cap is actually working in terms of keeping individual salaries down as much as it should (not saying do away with it, but wondering if it could be structured better to accomplish that one thing). The GMs, instead of using the cap to keep salaries in check, seem to be trying to game each other into overpaying, and in really weird ways. Lowe with the Vanek thing last year...it's not like Edmonton faces Buffalo regularly, so what gives? The strategies a lot of the GMs are taking are things I'm just not understanding.

Dr. Turkleton said...

jyo...

didn't mean to jump on you...just to say that you were right in your correction of me...

my memory is going bad at my old age & I like to go back to make sure I'm not just making things up!!!! [I chalk it up to too much Big League Chew™ as a youth!]


[Hossa: 19:9]

KJ said...

thank you pensblog for your recap of FAs the other day. my kings fan friend is big on figuring out who should go where and such and for once i was able to help! unfortunatly he let me know the vulture king fans also would love to get their ice skates into orpik (or as i've taught him to say "candyman").

as for all the trade rumours, i cannot wait til the summer ends. pierre the pirahna should stick to waxing his head instead of speaking.

I Have Kasparaitis said...

I finally got on the internet! Verizon hates me apparentlly ...

@jefe penguino: I was gonna warn you about the big f'in Q ...

"To enjoy hockey, you have to be dumber than a box of rocks or been raised dumb in this aspect (i.e. the unfortunate cursed Canadians among us)." So how much does this guy know? Apparently nothing. Thanks for making America look stupid with your anti-Canada talk. You have to be beyond an idiot to make a comment like this. I hope this man gets hit in the face by a puck and Sean Avery and Ottawa Senators try to "nurse" him back to health ... he might like it, though ... I hope he takes a slapshot from Chara to the face and since his head is basically hollow, it will blow right through and destroy his brain-stem ... there, much more effective.

@BigK: Well, he obviously asked a man about his stick, so that statement goes to Charlie (who is getting married) ... no woman in their right mind would wanna sleep with Pierre McGuire. I want to vomit now ...

@redwings: Stay away from Bugsy and Free Candy ... they're mine ... *laughs*

I'm not buying these trade rumors at all ...

Stilly said...

@Stoosh

I absolutely LOVE the idea of having Staal as a winger. Someone (might have been you) made that suggestion a couple of days ago, and no one really agreed.

I've said before, if Staal is as big a deal as people say he is, then there's no way you can justify putting him on the third line. He has second or first line potential. Like you said, I'd put him with Geno and Syko. Sounds like a pretty good line to me. Of course, that still leaves Bing without a sniper on the wing.

I say Hossa is gone, the pens pick up Prospal for 2 mil or Ryder for 3 or 3.5 mil and try and keep Malone. (4 mil?) That's probably the same or less than you pay for Hossa. Top two lines:

Malone - Crosby - Prospal
Staal - Geno - Syko

Not a bad couple of lines.

Pensgirl said...

Stilly I'd get excited about those lines.

jefe penguino said...

@ihk -thanks, i love that fucking Q!

lets see what team it sends hossa to in my dreams tonight.

Sooska said...

@stoosh,stilly,pensgirl- doesn't Staal prefer to play his natural position? just wondering what his stance on this.

@kaspar - regarding that golf blogger I had the thought when I read him (and I play golf myself) that if golf became more like it was depicted in Happy Gilmore (specifically the Bob Barker incident)or those old commercials that showed a golfer being checked off the green(I can't recall the product or show but it was funny) more people would like to watch it. An element of risk and danger is always good in sports-where is it in golf?

@wilsmith- Ok I see where you are going so I think we are talking different things. I was going by your exact words. For purposes of the rights-type trades your point is understood-they have to cooperate. My point was that the players generally don't choose the team they get traded to, except under very specific contractural circumstances which aren't in the contracts of most non-superstars. that's all.

Carroll said...

@ chica - I hope you are doing okay today. I know you were going to be upset because of Trevor Lindens retirement announcement he made today.

Retiring 20 years to the day after being drafted by the same team. How cool is that. I know he only played for them for 16 years but still cool to begin/end your 20 year career with the same team.

As for the FA: I am waiting to see what happens. You all make so many good points...

This is what I think:
1. I think Hossa will be gone.
2. I think Bugsy will be gone.
They both will be asking for too much money.
3. Orpik will stay.
4. Gary will be back!!

I don't see them moving Staal to winger, although he would do a great job there too. I can see him having doubts as to whether he should stay or if he can be a 1/2 center somewhere else after next year.

I would hate to be Shero with all the decisions he has to make this year because he has to consider all the UFA/RFA that are coming up next year.

The Pens will look very different next year and may not be recognizable the following year. Have to ensure the core players of Sid, Geno, Jordan, Marc are all secured and work from there. Not an easy task with all these "superstars".

debrisslide said...

I'd bet with someone that we don't have Hossa next year. This year Crosby only made 850k in salary--Hossa made 7 million. We hadn't started dishing out huge numbers yet and that made Hossa fit. Next year we have huge numbers to both deal with immediately (re: whomever we are able to joyously resign) and speculate about for the future of the team (re: Malkin). I don't expect that Hossa can fit next year. And I think trying to keep him at the kind of numbers that he would command would probably be suicide in terms of long-term building for the Pens.

Call bullshit on me? Thoughts?

Dr. Turkleton said...

CAPUTI !!!!!

Sooska said...

@dr turk- All I can say is Kid, you ain't seen nothing yet! And maybe, wait till next year.

Stilly said...

@sooska

Like Stoosh said, Staal played on the wing before. I'll say it again, If Staal refuses to play the wing, you can't justify signing him to a big extension. I don't think you can put a team together with three good centers and no one to play on the wing with them.

So do you not sign Staal, hope he has a good season, and see what you can get for him?

I Have Kasparaitis said...

@Sooska: Totally agree ... I would watch golf if Happy Gilmore was playing ... or even if Caddy Shack was going on ... I can't sit there and watch golf. I love watching sports but seriously if it was more risky ... the only risk they have is popping their knee caps when they swing wrong.

@jefe penguino: *Laughs* You're risking going into a coma ... but maybe you'll wake up and it'll be next season. *laughs* Denis Leary has to be one of my fav. comedians because he's so angry ... it's hilarious ... and thanks to my computer, I'm in an asshole kinda mood ...

Steel City Assault's has a few videos up that are fan-voted hits and shoot-out goals of the season ...

Shoot-Out

Hits

I'm excited for Caputi. Granted I really didn't know he was until Stoosh talked about him, but I have been watching him a lot lately and I think he's fantastic. He seems like a great player, and I would love to see him develop even more. Thanks for the article, Dr. Turk.

Pensgirl said...

Sooska I haven't heard whether Staal himself has a preference, but I know HCMT wants him at center. I personally prefer him at center too, but he is talented enough to be top-six and it would mean you could re-sign Adam Hall for the fourth line center spot and bump Max up to third-line. Moving Jordan and re-signing Hall leaves more room to try to go after Bugsy, and then you've got three of the top four winger spots filled and no holes at center.

The only rumor I heard was that Staal supposedly wants to be top-six. If that were true (big IF) then either he's set on leaving us or he must be OK with being a winger - you know he knows he can't beat out the two centers ahead of him on this team.

Sooska said...

@stilly- I wasn't arguing at all -just wondering. I'd expect most guys want to play their "natural" position and where they feel comfortable. Seems like this has been an issue(and by that I don't mean complaint but more that it has been a notable topic of discussion) on this team with Geno, Staalsy and even Max.

@carroll- How in hell did I miss Trevor Linden retiring?
The more I read and hear about the Pens free agency situation the more daunting the task seems. I am betting Shero looks about 10 years older on September 1. I kind of have the idea that the GMs of the EC are in a darkened smoke filled room plotting ways to facilitate dismantling the Pens. GMs

Sooska said...

@pensgirl- yeah it's a question all right. Anywhere else he'd be a lock at top 6 and a chance to be like Eric (Cup and money)

megz590 said...

Reading the rumor about Malkin traded to the LA Kings kind of hit a nerve. He was interviewed by Steigy on Feb 15 and said his favorite cities were New York and LA. Put yourself in Geno's shoes. Being the number and face on his own team, leading in points, living in a city you love, getting paid whatever the hell you want. As much as i love Malkin, i could see this trade happening. He flourished while Crosby was out, and maybe he did enjoy being out of his shadow. Maybe he enjoyed it a little too much...

J.S. said...

I still think it's possible for Hossa to sign for around 8 mil per. He did mention that if we wanted money, he would have stayed in Atlanta.

yr 1 - 7.0
yr 2 - 8.0
yr 3 - 8.5
yr 4 - 9.0

Not sure how that would work with the cap after year two, since you never can tell how the salary cap will rise. But with the first year, it'll allow some room to negotiate with other players.

Thoughts?

Dr. Turkleton said...

j.s.

I believe it's the average over the life of the contract that is the number that's used for cap purposes...

so, using your example: his cap hit would be 8.125/yr

debrisslide said...

@megz - Yeah. I can understand why the Kings would want him desperately, but he can't carry the team and that is a team that hasn't had much success, period. Plus, we don't know what they guy wants. Unless I can sit him down face-to-face and ask him what's up (which will not happen) I don't want to speculate about his feelings. If he wanted to be a high-earning star player on a team that probably won't win a damn thing anytime soon, I'd probably lose respect for him, though. Malkin deserves a Cup and if his heart is in the game he won't want a trade like that. Unless he's just that swell of a guy that he wants to pull a losing team out of the bottom of the barrel and into the playoffs--but like I said, he can't do it by himself.

Stilly said...

You are correct Dr. Turk. It's an average of the total salary.

I Have Kasparaitis said...

@megz590: No offense, but I can't see this happening. He gets all the benefits of being a super star here w/o having to talk to the media unless he wants to. Plus, the Kings aren't in a position for a Cup run, sure, they are working on their team, but it's highly unlikely that they are gonna see the Cup anywhere but on TV (unless they decide to attend a game.) Malkin likes it here, too. He likes the city, but that's not enough for him to go there. And I know Shero would not go for anyone on their team ... no one is worth Malkin on their team. He's gonna get paid nicely here after this season's performance, but no way are the King's going to make a legit grab for Malkin, unless he pulls a Jagr "dying alive." I think a lot of people look at this team and say Malkin and Sid are the faces, it's just the people outside of hockey that don't see that. He is part of the core, and Shero is not going to let him slip away. Then you could say Malkin could be going to New York because he credited that as his favorite city ... don't buy into it. Geno ain't going anywhere for right now because he's not ready to speak with the media and control a team. When Sid got injured, he was still always behind the scenes and Bugsy took a bigger role in the locker room than he already did as well as Conks who can be credited with making us the team we are as well. Plus, Malkin's got a nice thing going with Gonchar ... who on the King's would be Geno's Sarge? They have Alexander Frolov who is only a bit older than him. Sarge and Frolov are not the same. All in all, I think the rumors with Malkin are just bullshit to be honest.

debrisslide said...

yeah ihk, I forgot about the great situation Malkin has with Gonchar. And he's such a goofball with the media. When you hear his words in full through an interpreter he sounds kind of self-deprecating (which I think is cute but not good for leadership). . .probably not ready to be the face of a team.

Stilly said...

This is me hoping you're right IHK. I can't imagine him wanting to leave after the run they had this year.

He'll get paid by the Pens and him and Sid will win lots of cups...

... at least that's what I repeat to myself regularly.

I Have Kasparaitis said...

@stilly: I just think it's ridiculous right now ... he doesn't seem ready yet. With Sid, he's used to the attention, especially because of the lock-out. Geno is still having some issues and he isn't conditioned yet ... he was struggling a lot because he's used to playing what 40-50 games a year in Russia, and last year, he was inujured. What I'm saying is he's not ready. All the signs point to him staying here, unless a legit Stanley Cup seeking hockey team comes in the picture ... and I would be guessing the already have their "Sid," so the talk of him being the face of a team has to wait for a couple years. But what do I know ... I don't play hockey, I just watch it, and I have no idea what Geno's thinking ...

ogre39666 said...

it might have been said already, but NHLToL (http://nhllogos.blogspot.com/) is starting a Wallpaper Wednesday, and there is an amazing Hossa one up; thought you guys would like to check it out.

Dan said...

luca caputi!!!!!!!

i will give my right nut for ryan malone to stay here.

J.S. said...

Eh, that's right, I forgot that they used the average figure and didn't use the yearly amounts.

My idea = fail?

TheNWChica said...

@carroll: I'm fine...he seemed very content, and when Trev is happy, I'm happy. :) Thank you! *hugs*

Colin said...

Here is a question for you guys.

If you could do either (all other things equal) of the following for the next 5 years would you rather...

*sign Staal and Hossa for 10M total
*sign Malkin for 8M a year

I know there are some other factors that could go into it, but just on the surface.

Thoughts?

Zach said...

Malkin. Hands down.

I don't think you get the production from Staal that you get from Malkin.

I Have Kasparaitis said...

@colin: My first instinct is Malkin ... but I'm not sure. I cannot do just on the surface ... I'm a details person. Hossa is going to last for only long and he will decline in talent. With Staal, he doesn't have the natural abilities of Malkin. Sid's price is 8.7 million, I think Malkin's is a pretty good deal ... I take Malkin without going deep into detail.

Colin said...

I honestly do not know which I would choose.

I think you have to keep Malkin. The thing is, he is a bonafide superstar. He is one of the top three players in the league / world. I just don't think I can let that go.

Carroll said...

@ Colin - you said:
"*sign Staal and Hossa for 10M total
*sign Malkin for 8M a year"

10M TOTAL vs 8M per year???
Or did you mean 10M for both per year vs 8M for Malkin.

I would choose Staal & Hossa for the extra 2M. Staal 2nd line centre, Hossa for Sid.

Colin said...

@ carroll -

You get Hossa and Staal for a combined 10M a year.

debrisslide said...

@colin - Malkin. Staal is very young though and we all know he's going to become better as the years go on, but he hasn't been the same force that Malkin has been. And I definitely wouldn't pick Malkin over Hossa in any situation. Malkin has more seasons to play than Hossa does, in theory, and his development should be incredible to watch.

Zach said...

I kinda hope that Shero doesn't sign Staal to an extension, he has a good year and commands 4 mil or more. That'll net the Pens a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick from whoever gives Staal an offer sheet.

Three picks and more cap space, and Staal gets to be a first or second line center.

wilsmith said...

yeah, sooska, i figured we were just arguing different topics.

Go Shero.

Stilly said...

Previous post was me. I was on another account. Lame.

jefe penguino said...

to M. HOSSA: you are gold. i reeeally would like you to stay somehow. if it turns out you leave, youve been one of the best rent-a-players a fan could dream of. with that, if youre not here by season start, i will pretend you never were. ouch.

@colin -id like to keep 71 forever (or at least a minimum of 3 Cups)

this is kinda like me and gino kickin it last friday night. wooo.

Stilly said...

I think you have to keep Malkin since he's definitely one of the top 5 players in the world.

Pay him. Let Hossa leave. Let Staal's contract wait until after the next season and hope he gets better than 4 mil.

I can't foresee Staal sticking around unless he is receptive to switching positions.

Carroll said...

colin - I understood the question I was just pointing out the wording you used to state over 5 years - Staal/Hossa TOTAL 10M (with the lack per year) which you stated for Malkin.

I still chooses Staal/Hossa. Even if Jordan does not produce as much as Geno, Marian more then makes up the difference. You would still be ahead on production totals with those 2 in the line versus just Geno.

Stilly said...

I disagree completely Carroll.

Geno - 106 points.

Hossa - 66 pts.
Staal - 28 pts.

I'm sorry but I just cannot imagine letting Malkin go for those two guys.

TheNWChica said...

Should I do it?

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